Willow and the Storm

Apr 21, 2010 at 2:20 AM
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thecrown said:
Just have a limited amount of shots on screen.

Great idea!
If it were a gun. |P
Though you'll only be able to cast it a set number of times before you have to recharge your spells.
 
Apr 21, 2010 at 1:21 PM
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This project is looking complex&cool. My suggestion is that u create an original funny character for the mod (like Balrog for CS). A little humor is good even for a serious mod.
 
Apr 21, 2010 at 1:41 PM
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Not sure if this is what he meant, but for a limited number of shots on screen... here's an idea. Suppose the max number of blocks onscreen is 6. Then, once you create a seventh block, the first disappears. When you create an eighth block, the second disappears, etc.
 
Apr 21, 2010 at 2:07 PM
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But that gets to VARIABLES.
Since what he is doing is not a gun, but rather a very, very, very clever TSC script, he would have to record the position of the blocks with flags, and then go back and CMP them into nothingness, with as many events as there are tiles. Why oh why would he ever do that?
 
Apr 21, 2010 at 2:29 PM
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I dunno. Because it's a fun idea?
 
Apr 21, 2010 at 3:26 PM
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*cough* assembly *cough*
 
Apr 21, 2010 at 4:00 PM
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I can imagine no way on earth that doing that sort of thing with TSC could be any easier than assembly.
Personally I find TSC to be a nightmare for getting anything done, I'd rather write an entity that does it for me.
 
Apr 21, 2010 at 7:00 PM
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I don't get why you want to do EVERYTHING with TSC lace.

It's just silly when you have so much more at your disposal with assembly.
 
Apr 21, 2010 at 7:41 PM
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trickybilly said:
This project is looking complex&cool. My suggestion is that u create an original funny character for the mod (like Balrog for CS). A little humor is good even for a serious mod.

Already planned in spades. ;D

Celtic Minstrel said:
Not sure if this is what he meant, but for a limited number of shots on screen... here's an idea. Suppose the max number of blocks onscreen is 6. Then, once you create a seventh block, the first disappears. When you create an eighth block, the second disappears, etc.

Good idea.
But... Doesn't fit well with the rest of what I have planned.

Lace said:
But that gets to VARIABLES.
Since what he is doing is not a gun, but rather a very, very, very clever TSC script, he would have to record the position of the blocks with flags, and then go back and CMP them into nothingness, with as many events as there are tiles. Why oh why would he ever do that?

In other words, add an extra year to the project.

Celtic Minstrel said:
I dunno. Because it's a fun idea?

So's the idea of putting monkeys in a barrel.
Until you REALLY think about it.

Wedge of Cheese said:
*cough* assembly *cough*

Not worth it.
I know how cool it would be to be able to re-build levels with synthetic blocks and all, but...
It's kinda funny, actually.
The original concept for Adamant Platform was for it to spawn an elevator like from the Core.

Noxid said:
I can imagine no way on earth that doing that sort of thing with TSC could be any easier than assembly.
Personally I find TSC to be a nightmare for getting anything done, I'd rather write an entity that does it for me.

Well, it's about the same difficulty either way for me.
I know next to dick about assembly, but lack the patience to track every single possible tile with flags.

In order to keep it simple and not have too much overlap with Nimble Nimbus (which if you think about it is really a mobile version of Adamant Platform), I'm thinking replacing AP with 'Knitting Wounds', basically a light heal spell (3-5 HP, still debating).
Mainly because the Wizard class will lack level 1 alchemy.
The reason is plot-related and so I can't spoil it.
It may look like an ad-hoc/workdodge, but I was debating this point for a while - Adamant Platform would be like this mod's Portal Gun and add a new degree of impossibility to proper level testing.
Though I am keeping Nimble Nimbus because it's a tricky beast to control - You can only vaguely steer it, it tends to, errr... Ride up on you, and it's needed by the Wizard to get to a certain alchemical ingredient.

Danderspore
Also, a certain shopkeeper had a bad experience with a wizard...

Anyways!
Last little thing about the Wizard - His spells need to be limited, but I'm torn between having all spells cast from the same pool, or having each spell with a D&D-like spells-per-day dealio.
Casting them all from the same pool would be the easy way because that's one tracker for all 6 spells, but tracking each with its own limits lets me limit certain spells more (like Thunderclap Torrent and Brimstone Barrage).
In either case, the Wizard will be limited to 12 spells total before he needs to [EXPUNGED].

Regarding the other classes...

Warrior (my favorite in terms of how little scripting extra is needed) is basically done.
In all seriousness, Warrior is the literal tank class - HUGE gun and lots of armor.

Thief is... Done as well, to a degree.
The majority of the Thiefs bonus to playing stems from his possession of the Red Paperclip and is basically plot-driven, so will develop along side the actual game and manifest as otherwise inaccessable areas with rather appreciable bonuses.

Monk... Monk...
Basically done, again. Monk will be a lot like Thief in terms of its bonuses being intertwined with the plot and side areas with nice gifts in them.
Though the methods will be incredibly different - Monk has Booster 0.8 and an Air Tank off the bat, where as the Thief gets stealthy-ness and lock-picking skills.

And... Ronin.
Ronin will be done when the other classes are done, as it is based off of the other classes.

So basically, in terms of character system, it's done except for the Wizards spells.
 
Apr 21, 2010 at 10:50 PM
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DragonBoots said:
In other words, add an extra year to the project.

If that really took you an extra year to implement, even if it wasn't the 3 of you working on it together, that would just be sad. That would be like "failing at life" sad.

At the most I could see it taking maybe a month.
 
Apr 24, 2010 at 4:56 AM
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Apr 24, 2010 at 4:58 AM
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Way to remind me of the monk guy in Black and White, bootsy.
Way to be.



Oh, your little blurb sounds like an advertisement. All well and good though.
Favorite song is still the world over. By a mile and some.

Oh, and I assume you're going to have normal, rest, action, and boss for all five? Better make some global tracks too, sides the title and young adventurer and the like. Make it so you won't get sick of the music, coz even the best stuff overplayed is awful (see coldplay).
 
Apr 24, 2010 at 5:15 AM
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Lace said:
Way to remind me of the monk guy in Black and White, bootsy.
Way to be.



Oh, your little blurb sounds like an advertisement. All well and good though.
Favorite song is still the world over. By a mile and some.

Oh, and I assume you're going to have normal, rest, action, and boss for all five? Better make some global tracks too, sides the title and young adventurer and the like. Make it so you won't get sick of the music, coz even the best stuff overplayed is awful (see coldplay).

I'm sorry?

Cool.

And yeah, there will be some global tracks, and potentially a second action and normal for each.
Boss and Rest are pretty rarely used, anyways.
 
Apr 24, 2010 at 11:23 PM
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Umm... didn't we decide on FIVE tracks per class, not four?

1 - rest
2 - lull
3 - normal
4 - action
5 - boss

:(
 
Apr 25, 2010 at 1:02 AM
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:(
Realized how pathetically little I actually know about this grand ol' mod, so I read through every every everything again.

This is awesome.

For the alchemy system, why do you have a limitation of the two element things being the same level as eachother (just coding simplicity?), it would actually be kinda awesome to mix a teir 3 fire and a teir 2 earth to get something that's more fire then earth, but meh. Of course, as I write this, I realize more and more the implausibility and coding-hellishness this would entail, so you probably shouldn't and won't do it.

Now, If I'm reading the first post goodly enough, the first third of the game is before you're the mink, the rat and the banker/whatever other rodent you choose to become, right? This will probably be by far the hardest part of the game to keep interesting, as you won't have access to the classy goodness of said mink, rat, etcetera. I really don't know what you could do to make this part not just a means to an end, but it really could be cool, given time.
Of course, I probably just misinterpereted the first post/forgot what it said, so this too could just be a moot point.

Lastly for the mo, how are you planning on having the wizards spells work? W and then a selection menu, or something more advanced? The spells the wizard has (*cough* brimstone barrage *cough*) could be really, really, really fun/awesomely awesome to use, as well as a novelty, but only if implemented nicely enough. Having to go to your items screen to cast each spell would be god awful and incredibly tasking in action/boss zones. (Ha, moot free!)

@Cheesenip: Lull sounds cool. Not that I have any decision power at all, but yes. Also, why are there no songs for the other classes as awesome as the world over? eh?
Edit: Tually, I like the thief one too.
 
Apr 25, 2010 at 2:25 AM
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Lace said:
For the alchemy system, why do you have a limitation of the two element things being the same level as eachother (just coding simplicity?), it would actually be kinda awesome to mix a teir 3 fire and a teir 2 earth to get something that's more fire then earth, but meh.
Yeah, I was starting to wonder about that.
 
Apr 25, 2010 at 2:59 AM
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Wedge of Cheese said:
Umm... didn't we decide on FIVE tracks per class, not four?

1 - rest
2 - lull
3 - normal
4 - action
5 - boss

:(
Oh, right. ^^;
I'm bad at rememberizing stuff that happened more than 72 hours ago.
Yes, 5 tracks per class.
Lace said:
:o
Realized how pathetically little I actually know about this grand ol' mod, so I read through every every everything again.

This is awesome.

For the alchemy system, why do you have a limitation of the two element things being the same level as eachother (just coding simplicity?), it would actually be kinda awesome to mix a teir 3 fire and a teir 2 earth to get something that's more fire then earth, but meh. Of course, as I write this, I realize more and more the implausibility and coding-hellishness this would entail, so you probably shouldn't and won't do it.

Now, If I'm reading the first post goodly enough, the first third of the game is before you're the mink, the rat and the banker/whatever other rodent you choose to become, right? This will probably be by far the hardest part of the game to keep interesting, as you won't have access to the classy goodness of said mink, rat, etcetera. I really don't know what you could do to make this part not just a means to an end, but it really could be cool, given time.
Of course, I probably just misinterpereted the first post/forgot what it said, so this too could just be a moot point.

Lastly for the mo, how are you planning on having the wizards spells work? W and then a selection menu, or something more advanced? The spells the wizard has (*cough* brimstone barrage *cough*) could be really, really, really fun/awesomely awesome to use, as well as a novelty, but only if implemented nicely enough. Having to go to your items screen to cast each spell would be god awful and incredibly tasking in action/boss zones. (Ha, moot free!)

@Cheesenip: Lull sounds cool. Not that I have any decision power at all, but yes. Also, why are there no songs for the other classes as awesome as the world over? eh?
Edit: Tually, I like the thief one too.

andwhyisit said:
Yeah, I was starting to wonder about that.

@andwhy and Lace, RE: Alchemy ranks - It's not that I didn't want to do it that way, it's just impractical (unless I included something like a materials 1.5 and 2.5 which can mix different ranks); but also there is an upper limit on the number of useful items I can come up with - 5 different healing potions would be redundant.
I suppose I could make it happen, but there would be 2 half-rank materials for each half-rank - Each of the two would cover 6 of the 12 combinations of 2 elements between 2 ranks.
Basically, too much bother to add 1 or 2 more items and a shitload of redundant healing tonic variants.
This is a case where simplicity and effeciency is the best option, as it also smooths down the alchemy system.

'Sides, I've already given you multiple (up to 9) quantities of the 24-odd inventory items for alchemy (some alchemy items result in an immediate effect - specifically the Essence Chip/Fragment/Shard and the Transmutations).
I think it's at the critical point where adding any more will complicate it too much - both for me scripting and the player using it.

And, with regards to the Wizards spells, yes, it will use the W key.
In fact, all classes except Warrior have an ability tied to the W key.
Thief has Stealth.
Monk toggles his Breath Control.
Ronin... Well.
Ronin depends on what training you choose.
Only reason Warrior doesn't have a W key command is because his training is a passive one - +3 life off the bat and +1 per Life Boon.

Anyways~

The 'first third' of the game lasts all of 3 minutes if you're in a rush.
But, that said, your point is valid.
What I'm going to avoid doing as much as possible is railroading the player to a story.
Rather I'm going to let them participate in many small stories as they wish.
Or if they so choose, not.
The only part that will be somewhat railroaded is in the very beginning, when you choose your class.
 
Apr 25, 2010 at 3:52 AM
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To combine items across ranks but cut down on the fluff it may be better to determine the created item's rank by "(x+y)-1" (or alternatively "(x+y)/2"), where x and y are the source items' ranks, and use this in conjunction with the elements to determine the item. This will only add 12 extra items and gives the player the illusion of more freedom.

Keep the source items (materials) as ranks 1, 2, and 3. But just have extra ranks for the created items.

For instance "Bottled Air" (Rank 1, Air) and Hoarfrost (Rank 3, Water) will produce the same results as Kite Down (Rank 2, Air) and Dew (Rank 2, Water).

Have a witty message come up if someone tries to combine two items of the same element, either that or simply disable the first item's element in the second item selection screen.

Code:
Lesser Healing Tonic  		1  	Air  	Earth
Essence Chip 			1 	Air 	Fire
Crude Trans. - Earth/Fire 	1 	Air 	Water
Crude Trans. - Air/Water 	1 	Earth 	Fire
Rallying Cry 			1 	Earth 	Water
Malicious Malignants 		1 	Fire 	Water
???	 			1.5 	Air 	Earth
???	 			1.5 	Air 	Fire
???	 			1.5 	Air 	Water
???	 			1.5 	Earth 	Fire
???	 			1.5 	Earth 	Water
???	 			1.5 	Fire 	Water
Greater Healing Tonic 		2 	Air 	Earth
Essence Fragment 		2 	Air 	Fire
Refined Trans. - Earth/Fire 	2 	Air 	Water
Refined Trans. - Air/Water 	2 	Earth 	Fire
Shadow Ally 			2 	Earth 	Water
Prodigy Parasite 		2 	Fire 	Water
???	 			2.5 	Air 	Earth
???	 			2.5 	Air 	Fire
???	 			2.5 	Air 	Water
???	 			2.5 	Earth 	Fire
???	 			2.5 	Earth 	Water
???	 			2.5 	Fire 	Water
Bodyforger 			3 	Air 	Earth
Essence Shard 			3 	Air 	Fire
Perfect Trans. - Earth/Fire 	3 	Air 	Water
Perfect Trans. - Air/Water 	3 	Earth 	Fire
Kings' Army 			3 	Earth 	Water
Synthesis Symbiote 		3 	Fire 	Water
 
Apr 25, 2010 at 4:02 AM
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andwhyisit said:
To combine items across ranks but cut down on the fluff it may be better to determine the created item's rank by "(x+y)-1" (or alternatively "(x+y)/2"), where x and y are the source items' ranks, and use this in conjunction with the elements to determine the item. This will only add 12 extra items and gives the player the illusion of more freedom.

For instance "Bottled Air" (Rank 1, Air) and Hoarfrost (Rank 3, Water) will produce the same results as Kite Down (Rank 2, Air) and Dew (Rank 2, Water).

Have a witty message come up if someone tries to combine two items of the same element, either that or simply disable the first item's element in the second item selection screen.

And 'lo we return to 2-step alchemy.
As it is I've got it figured out for 1-step alchemy so-far.
And this is a case where I'd be willing to sacrifice selection size for streamlining.
I mean, you're in a boss fight with 1 hp left.
Would you rather have to open your inventory once or twice?
I dunno.
Adding a second step is kinda like the "Do you really want to save?" of gaming.

That said, it's a very good idea.
Except, of course, the math breaks down pretty quickly.
Basically, in the event a rank 1 and 2 or 2 and 3 are mixed, do I call it a rank 1 or 2 or 3?
If I'm rounding down, only rank 3 can be produce rank 3 items.
If I round up, it makes rank 3 items too accessable.

'Sides, in-game lore will explain why you can't mix Charcoal with Kite Down. :(
 
Apr 25, 2010 at 4:18 AM
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Question - what exactly is this two step alchemy of which you speak? Is it exactly as self evident as it seems?
Also, just round down, having two teir three items should be the only way to make a teir three ending thingy.
 
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