Okay I can confirm that the "black part" was a misunderstanding/derp on my part, because for some reason I always thought that this part was always transparent. As I said before, not important at all.
4. Will (try to) fix
6. Eh. I could add some sparkles to the first statue to make it clear they should be interacted with, but I think it's pretty obvious to talk to the one down in the hole seeing as it's the only thing there.
Could you be more specific about what you mean regarding trial and error? The Fall shows you where you'll drop (the first time at least - I could remove the skipflags but I didn't want the scenes to become tedious), and The Trench is pretty easy after the part where you reach the Booster 0.8. I could up the starting HP to 6, but the player would still be screwed if they took a spike to the knee and then had to get through the part with the enemies without getting hit.
Yeah, the Rest station is basically a puzzle area, but I wanted to do something vaguely interesting with the life caps. I decided 18 (with 21 as a bonus) was a good balance for the middle four areas, because that's roughly what they were originally designed around (only ToT and BMMJ had a lot more). The only other part I can think of that's memory-heavy is the first Grit Zone wind section, but once you pass the first part it's rather easy to cheese it, especially with the Legs Shield.
4. I'l try that again when I do it legitimately and see if it happens again. It was very strange, indeed.
6. Now, before we move on, are we talking about the one circled in yellow or in red? Because it is possible to reach the one circled in red without knowing that the one circled in yellow exists.
Most of the beginning up to and including Grit Zone is pretty much trial and error, but I had only 3 HP because I missed the life capsules in the beginning.
And also...
Don'tremovethoseskipflagsinthebegginningohgodnoforgetisaidanything.
Although, there could be something optional such as sign or some other object that the player can go to rather than have it repeat itself every single time.
I think I'll wait and see if anyone else has a problem with this first .-. I also don't know how to access Itoh's right-facing sprite so what I can do with him is a bit limited. Probably a basic system message would be best.
6. Now, before we move on, are we talking about the one circled in yellow or in red? Because it is possible to reach the one circled in red without knowing that the one circled in yellow exists.
I like to take the cool kids route and exit the pyramid with the blade. Any plans to incorporate that? Or will my blade become lost forever when I go into the dream world.
Also I *think* that I might have some solutions to some problems.
Problem: The Fall and health values
Solution: Jack up the starting HP to 7 or 8, but no more than 10. The player still gets to get hit by the spikes once, and the player won't be immensely screwed when he gets to the area with the enemies if the starting HP was 6. This also does not interfere with The Void because the spikes will still be a one-hit-kill (hence "no more than 10")
Problem: Dunc's mod requires too much trial and error to accomplish
Solution: Give the player a gun. This gives the player a way to "feel around" with your gun and locate any platforms. As for spikes, I have no idea. I was thinking of using breakable blocks, but then I remembered that they only use one texture and that would easily go against the idea of a void.
Problem: Player would have no idea that you can interact with the statues. The first one that the player encounters can vary
Solution: Add a statue with sparkles in the beginning of Mayogetsu, to justify that this statue is the first statue and so it can tell you that you can interact with others like it.
Oh and more glitches/errors
When you fall off the bottom of Dunc's mod, you just continue down. Needs a H/V Trigger with the falling death script.
Missing <KEY in the bedroom after Lunarsuld's part and before the pipe area (before destruction)
I have to agree with Hiino. With only 4hp to my name by the time I hit grit zone and a set of spikes that I need to pass through I can't really progress any further in the mod.
As for The Fall, maybe it would be good to keep the health values as is and just add a save point before the monsters? It's too long a stretch to go through all three sections without saving, which makes the map too difficult. The Trench on the other hand is fine as it is difficulty-wise.
I have to agree with Hiino. With only 4hp to my name by the time I hit grit zone and a set of spikes that I need to pass through I can't really progress any further in the mod.
As for The Fall, maybe it would be good to keep the health values as is and just add a save point before the monsters? It's too long a stretch to go through all three sections without saving, which makes the map too difficult. The Trench on the other hand is fine as it is difficulty-wise.
I think what I'll do is up the starting health to 6 and put a single heart before the enemy section. I would prefer it if the base health were a multiple of 3, because that allows the health capsules in the Rest Station to give equal values.
If you have made it not speed run-y, it might be good if the save was added back into the pyramid (if you haven't done that already)
@LeVoid perhaps make the spikes visible? Not knowing what's going to kill you is a recipe for unfun.
Yeah missing the spikes was probably just me being a cheating bastard and using Doukutsu Trainer to see what was in the end.
And then there was nothing.
I couldn't figure out where to fit it in :x It also really shouldn't be that hard for anyone to find, especially if they've been keeping even half an eye on the thread.
Okay so does anybody else have anything add/anything to comment on after Zangetsu? Anything I don't get any feedback on I'm going to have to freeball and there won't be time to make many more changes after the first fix build.
EDIT: Also I do kind of need that teleporter light problem fixed or at least looked into so I know if I need to think of another gimmick :<
The only problem with the second half that I remember off the top of my head was that I found it somewhat questionable/weird (in the Pipe Maintenance area) to have a block that dissapears because of a H/V Trigger but then you have two blocks that looks exactly like an earlier block that requre the shot of your snake.
Also is there a proper ending to this mod or am I not looking hard enough?
The only problem with the second half that I remember off the top of my head was that I found it somewhat questionable/weird (in the Pipe Maintenance area) to have a block that dissapears because of a H/V Trigger but then you have two blocks that looks exactly like an earlier block that requre the shot of your snake.
Also I should note that Cave Story+ does not render the "=" as it did in the original version, as in they are actually rendered as "=" rather than circles.
So, I'm not sure who did what part of this, and I'm pretty late to the party here, and I'm not necessarily going to progress very far too soon. So I'm just gonna go ahead and make suggestions and report bugs for what I've found so far.
Suggestions:
- The beds in that room at the very beginning, it would be nice if you gave them flag 2000 events which have that "Do you want to take a rest?(YNJ)" for the beds, instead of getting question marks.
- Nice what you did with the door at the rest station and not being able to go back through,
but maybe you could also add another block to the tile set so that the top isn't black.
- Maybe you could add an event for the computer in the rest area next to Itoh so that instead of getting a question mark, it has a flag 2000 event with a message box that says something to the effect of "<MSGWords light up the screen...<NOD<CLR<TURShield up.<NOD<END"
- At the entrance to Grit Zone, is it on purpose that you can't go back to the rest
area? Cause it looks like there's a clear passage back to where I came from.
- There is a significant amount of room for improvement on the Grit Zone's level design.
Glitches:
- The treasure chest in the Grit Zone containing the Machine gun has the open chest entity appearing over the closed chest entity. Instead, the closed chest entity should be appearing over the open chest entity. I think some other chests had this problem.
- Nice with the tiles blocking off when you exit from getting the arms barrier,
but the tile sealing happens regardless of which side you're coming from, or whether or not you've got the Arms Barrier.
Not sure if or when I'll get further, but I guess I just had to contribute at least a tiny bit to this.
Hayden: I'd either decided against those things for a reason or they weren't a big enough deal to spend time on. The chests have been fixed, and the wall blocking off wasn't an error (what would it have to do with the Arms Barrier?); however, I moved the trigger over so that it would activate when coming out of either passage.
Anyway, this is probably the final build. Only essential changes will be made from here on out, e.g. if I've messed up somewhere, but that doesn't mean I don't want opinions on everything. If there is anything you want to mention, you'll need to get in quick, otherwise this is what you're stuck with. Here is a direct copy of all the alterations I noted in this version:
-Raised starting health to 6 [Map 13/Safe House]
-Added fall messages if the player somehow manages to get through the spikes
[Map 12/Void]
-Added extra message after wall closes [Map 12]
-Added intermittent visible blocks to serve as landmarks and hopefully make
things more reasonable [Map 12]
-Added a heart before the final fall [Map 10/The Fall]
-Added emphasis to Booster 0.8 equip message [Map 11/The Trench]
-Lowered all main life capsules to +4 [Map 29/Rest Station]
-Added system message alerting the player about life capsules
-Added a health terminal to the start of Grit Zone [Map 14/Grit Zone]
-Moved trigger for passage block to cover both exits [Map 14]
-Fixed chest layering issue [Map 14]; checked all other chests in the game too
-Changed first spike-boosting section slightly [Map 14]
-Solved teleporter problem [Map 16/Grit Zone Dust Storm]
-Changed interfering flag with [Map 1/Pinnacle] (#1400 to #1399) and made
general updates throughout the area [Map 16, 17]
-Added <KEY to event #0502 [Map 30/???]
-Added in a moving block as a better indicator to let the play know where the
second secret is [Map 19/Mayogetsu]
-Made all 'regular' statues sparkle [Map 18, 19, 20, 21]
-Added more detailed dialogue to manual transport sign [Map 6/Pipeline
Maintenance]
-Added <KEY to event #0210 [Map 9/Pipeline Maintenance?]
-Filled in base of tower with spikes to avoid water sound issue [Map 24/ToT 2F
Side 1]
-Made hidden sparkle visible once more; changed message [Map 27/Fs Caeirtv]
-Switched last health terminal with nearby save point and moved terminal to the
end [Map 27]
-Changed music to Break Down [Map 27]
-Made Booster 2.0 exit BMMJ and reset all flags [Map 26, 27, 28]
-Fixed left wall [Map 35/Safe House 2]
-Changed Booster's dialogue to give a hint about the hidden area before it's
permanently blocked off [Map 35]
-Made Momorin's final dialogue... final [Map 35]
It turns out that the teleporter lights are temperamental and don't like being near solid tiles, so thankfully that matter has been resolved. There are a couple of new problems or things I want checked, however:
-I was not able to reproduce the door problem that SEBTi encountered (10. Re-entering door in the Safe House after you fix everything in Hiino’s mod brings you to the bottom of the Tower of the Tempest. Tried this again and it brought me back normally. I don’t know why…), so I don't know if it's still a problem
-I only noticed this after the "final boss" scene, but it may have happened earlier: Something weird happened after removing the weapons, and I ended up with two 'empty' arms slots in the menu, one of which stuck out the border to the left
-Using the Booster 2.0 to reset BMMJ also causes some mild glitchiness, because like all menu events the menu has to be exited before it will take effect, and while it appears benign I want to make sure it can't break anything
-Any artifacts I might have left over from testing
-I forgot to mention this last time, but the event for the first moving block section in Ketsuekigetsu ends on a timer, to stop the platform at the bottom appearing unless the player does the first part 'right'. I'd really appreciate it if someone(s) could make sure that I got the time right and it's not possible to leave the moving box early and have it appear, or do it legit and have it fail somehow.
-Anything that looks remotely like it's not doing what it's supposed to be doing, or that seems to be missing, or that still could be significantly improved
Remember, it's up to you guys to make sure everything works properly, because I'm not checking through the entire game another time. Once again, this does not mean you should make changes without telling me. I'll talk to andwhyisit tomorrow morning about where to go from here regarding CS+ conversion. Time zones will actually benefit me for a change! As you can see, I did make quite a few tweaks, so if everything plays smoothly now Take 8 will finally be ready for (possible) publication.
As you can see, I did make quite a few tweaks, so if everything plays smoothly now Take 8 will finally be ready for 