KVTC: Final Fantasy Tactics Advance - Marche is Evil

Jul 23, 2008 at 6:02 AM
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Welcome to another episode of Kageryushin's Videogame Theories Corner. This time around we have one revolving around the popular Final Fantasy series, specifically the game Final Fantasy Tactics Advance! This contains spoilers and assumes you're familiar with the storyline to begin with.

Marche, with absolutely no evidence, believes that Magic Ivalice is an illusion and must be destroyed. This is despite the fact that the residents are unique characters who don't want to be destroyed and plead with him not to destroy their world. His friends desire to stay as well, including his sickly, wheelchair-bound brother who can walk there. Marche believes it must be destroyed because it is clearly an illusion (despite the fact that the idea that it's simply a parallel dimension makes just as much, if not more sense, and this would mean he's dooming an entire dimension). I interpret the game to be a standard "Insane Villain Wants to Destroy the World" plot, but from the perspective of the villain, who genuinely believes he's doing the right thing and is too deluded to perceive otherwise. Unless Li Grim didn't point out the fact that the Magic Ivalice was a dream world, in the end it would have amounted to Marche destroying the entire world based on his own delusions. Of course there’s this whole thing about how Marche is destroying the crystals in stark contrast to the heroes of many other Final Fantasy games, but that’s just icing on the cake.

I recall one of the later missions being set up to be where you kill the bullies from the first snowball fight in the intro who are all now zombies in the Magic Ivalice and it got me thinking. Doesn't it strike you that if some folks ended up as monsters, there's probably a good chunk of "real world" people stuck as minions? Minions that seem to exist just to be killed? Just because the four main kids got catered to in their little fantasy world doesn't mean everyone in it will be enjoying it as much as they do, methinks. That raises the more interesting question of... since Marche and crew killed those zombies, shouldn't the fallen be dead when the world changes back? What of all the people killed in the Jagd? Or like how everything magically materializes to make Marche's viewpoint correct; they just get resurrected with no memory of anything. And he just...knew that would happen. What about the babies that were likely born to couples who wouldn't have gotten together on Earth Ivalice? Well, there's a copy of Magic Ivalice for them. Because Marche can't be wrong about anything. Because he's a fucking psycho.

There is also this little thing that gives me the creeps about this issue: the "final" world may be no more or less real than the Magical Ivalice. The destruction of the final boss doesn't somehow refresh the universe in this case, it simply adds another layer of change. You can let Ivalice be as real or illusionary as you want, and it doesn't matter; everything the viewpoint character promises comes true. Of course, in that circumstance, Marche is even more of a dick -- he's slaughtered, crippled, and mauled vast numbers of individuals, altered reality again, and he's still fooling himself over an illusion that provides him exactly what he wants.

Let’s start at the beginning of his ambition to bring the world back to Earth Ivalice. When Marche found himself transported to Magic Ivalice, he still had a fleeting fantasy that seemed real to him. Perhaps it's a dream, perhaps it's real, who knows? But unlike most people, he decided that the memory he had of the place he came from was more real than the world in which he lived. No one else but him initially believed it. He had no proof beyond his own recollection, and yet he was adamant in his belief to the point of rejecting the reality in front of his face. The tricky word here is "initially". Later on he had proof and that proof helped justify his actions. Until then, however, he was acting purely on his own belief that what he saw in front of him was less real than the memories of a world he couldn't prove ever existed.

At first he believed that his old world existed even though he had absolutely no proof that it did outside of his own beliefs. Let’s say that you one day woke up in a whole new world, a fantastic world. There are no visible traces that the world you remember ever existed. Absolutely no one you know personally is around. All you have to indicate that world are your own memories. No one around you knows about this world but you. What’s wrong, your memory or those of thousands of people? Your memory is likely to be faulty, but NO, not to Marche. Sure, to cling to these things for a time is human nature, but in the game a long time passes between him arriving in Magic Ivalice and him getting proof the old world existed, and yet throughout this time he still believes that the old world existed and even destroys things that are important to the structure of the world that he believes are hindering him from going home.

Normally someone would eventually rationalize their memories as a dream and would accept the physical world around them as real. They’ll inherit that life and cast the old memories away to fit in. They’re likely the crazy ones in that situation, not the thousands of people around them. The past world may as well be interpreted as a figment of the person’s imagination, specifically a dream they had. This is inevitably the normal conclusion someone would come to along with the self-conscious belief that something might be wrong with them for forgetting the entirety of their past life in Magic Ivalice and instead having such vivid recollections of another world.

Of course, anyone who has such memories can’t possibly be normal, so it’s also entirely possible, if not even more likely that a person like that will absolutely refuse to accept that they are wrong or insane. Insane people usually believe they’re completely normal even though they rave about things that no one else can comprehend. Think about it. If you encountered someone who told you that they came from another world, would you believe them, or even think them normal in any way? Marche was, in many ways, technically crazy by all accounts at that point. Of course we all know that he was right and that he’s not really crazy… or is he? He did all that at the beginning without proof Original Ivalice was real with only his own beliefs and no one else‘s backing him just like a crazy person would. He did get proof later on, but until then he was very much the technical psycho.

Sure, he was right in the end. But to do all that? It's a form of insanity. Marche was insane because he doubted the tangible reality in front of him based on the dream, fantasy, memory, whatever he had of a world that he once thought as real as the world he was currently in, and worse, he acted upon that insanity and crushed the dreams of two other children, one of which was his own flesh and blood. Does that make him a villain? Maybe not from your perspective, but it sure doesn't make him a fucking hero.

You might say “to do that initially was insane then, but can you really call his later actions, motivated with proof of the other world's validity, insanity?” Of course not. That's when he starts to become a real dick. At first, he had the excuse of insanity. Later on, he decided that, while the world they were in was fun, it was time to go home. It's like a dude running rides at Disney World telling the kids that it's time to go home because the dude is tired of working. Doesn't mean the kids are tired, and it doesn't mean you ought to ruin their fun just 'cause you suck.

You could also argue that he’s not evil because he didn’t truly want to hurt other people, he just wanted to get home and that just required the sacrifice of many lives. Did Garland actively want to hurt people? No, he wanted immortality, the four fiends of chaos wanted to hurt people. His quest for immortality ultimately lead him to hurt people. Was this selfish? Hell yes. Did he care he was hurting people? Maybe, but probably not. Did he just ignore their suffering? We don’t know, but it’s definitely possible. In this way it’s possible to infer that Marche possesses this same selfishness that Garland did. Marche is as big a dick as Garland, the very first Final Fantasy villain. That’s really something.

If Marche hadn't gone FUCK THAT YOU'RE GOING HOME, who would be the wiser? Why is there this entirely selfish and stupid desire of “I MUST LIVE IN THE REAL WORLD EVEN IF IT'S HORRIBLE?” The dream world WAS the real world, just altered. If someone altered the world slightly so you won the lottery, would you go "FUCK THAT THIS ISN'T REAL" and try to change it? Marche didn't change the world because "OMG IT'S ALL A LIE." He didn't destroy the dream world because of some ideals or desire to free his friends. He did it because he's a selfish cock who DIDN'T CARE that his friends were happy or that he was killing all those people, he just personally wanted to go home.

Well, you could say, “being thankful for pain is stupid, but it makes us human and Marche just had the balls to realize that running away from your problems isn't a good way to live. Sure, it's not like his life was fucking roses everywhere. Doned was a no-good-invalid, but who was taking care of his ass? Marche.”

But then I’d have to say while the theme was SUPPOSED to be "don't run from your problems," it's not done that well when your problems are things like "You're a cripple who constantly has to go to the hospital for painful operations" or "Your mother is dead and your dad is a drunk and everyone hates you." Can't exactly do anything BUT run away or get into escapism for those problems, so the moral is broken. Only Marche and his girlfriend are able to confront and overcome their problems, but that’s only because they only have petty self-esteem issues.

Yeah, Marche handled his problems like a real man. Such horrible problems like "I'm awkward at school because I just moved" and "my mom doesn't pay as much attention to me as I want." Why couldn't the cripple deal with his problems? Oh wait, BECAUSE HE'S A FUCKING CRIPPLE. YOU CAN'T EXACTLY JUST DECIDE TO DEAL WITH IT. How about Mewt? Why can't he just suck it up and accept the fact that his entire life is on a downward spiral that will never get better, that his entire family is mocked around the town, that nobody remembers his dead mom except him and his loser, drunk dad? THAT'S SO SIMILAR TO MARCHE'S PROBLEMS, RIGHT? If FFTA was supposed to show us "Don't run away from your problems!" then they should've given us characters who could actually still run. You should find someone in a wheelchair then kick them and laugh and say "Just DEAL with it, buddy!" I'm sure that's a great moral lesson there.

In short, Marche is awesome. He wanted to get back to his home and none of his friends/family were strong enough to stop him, so fuck them. They should have fought harder. Pussies. Also, I love how Marche is self righteous enough to claim Doned has it better then him because mom pays more attention to his crippled ass. I think that was the best moment in the entire game. If you somehow still think that Marche was justified during his quest, then there’s something wrong with your head. So, I have every right to turn my sibling into a paraplegic and kill my best friend’s mother if they're in my way? Good to know!

Remember, in the end, this is in no way completely factual. This is all based on logic and conjecture. If you don’t want Marche to be evil, then that’s up to you. Unless it’s explicitly stated, there’s nothing that truly proves that Marche is the bad guy, however, acting as if there’s not much to imply the theory’s possibility is just plain ignorant. Then again, this entire theory is based upon the many gigantic flaws inherent in FFTA’s storyline because the writers sucked ass, but still, it’s there.
 
Jul 23, 2008 at 6:57 AM
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Speaking from running away from problems you can't fix, am I the only one who felt that girl's reason for wanting to stay was simply the stupidest thing ever? An albino girl who has to dye her hair everyday? Yes Square, I'm sure there are thousands of kids playing FFTA who TOTALLY relate to her.

At least 1 in 17,000 of them... A well-chosen niche target audience if I do say so myself!

It's like Square didn't even try. Marche just wanted to make things the way they were again because "it's just right!" (as has been discussed in far more details than I'd care to reproduce here; suffice to say Marche has a very one-track mind and is totally impossible to relate to, player-to-main-character.) Mewt's soul was raped by a nightmare who exploited his bad family life - ok granted this works, but it's not exactly epic. I think Doned is the only character who really had any reason to want to stay in the other Ivalice, really. Everybody else was just whining or caught up in something most people would just get over.

It's a shame how FFT was simply amazing, and then this game comes out with its... very unique... attempt at a storyline. :D
 
Jul 23, 2008 at 7:02 AM
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RuneLancer said:
Speaking from running away from problems you can't fix, am I the only one who felt that girl's reason for wanting to stay was simply the stupidest thing ever? An albino girl who has to dye her hair everyday? Yes Square, I'm sure there are thousands of kids playing FFTA who TOTALLY relate to her.

At least 1 in 17,000 of them...

Well, it was never explicitely stated she was an albino. Some people really do just have extremely white/blonde hair, but I guess saying she's an albino really works too. In any case, Ritz gave Marche someone to bang, and that was pretty much her biggest purpose, so yeah.
 
Jul 26, 2008 at 8:12 PM
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Kageryushin said:
In any case, Ritz gave Marche someone to bang, and that was pretty much her biggest purpose, so yeah.
I must have missed the romantic involvement between them. Seemed Ritz was more into that Viera following her around than into Marche, IMO... She wasn't very open and warm around him save for one scene needed to give her a reason for wanting to stay in Ivalice.

Her character felt really just like a flat 2D character-space-waster. Many of the characters do. They only play a minor supporting role to the storyline that's made to appear big (like that Ezel guy who sold those law-breakers - the whole point of that branch was to open up a shop which you'll only use once or twice through the course of the game, or Montblanc who first plays the important role of introducing you to Ivalice and to Clans but then becomes the annoying little sidekick who always agrees with the lead and provides no direct involvement with the storyline.) Where's the developement? Aside from everyone's problems with changing things back, we get absolutely nothing out of anyone.

Except for Mewt. The "villain" (of sorts.) He gets a good deal of developement because Ivalice is pretty much his creation. Or at least a reflection of his desires. And while he gets the spotlight often enough, what do we know of the rest of the crew? Montblanc owns a clan, Marche just moved to Ivalice and has trouble making friends, Doned wants attention from his parents, Ritz's hair is pale and she has to dye it (come on Square, try a little harder... -_-), and... I think that's about all there is to know about your guys, really.

FFTA just leaves me with a big sigh followed by a disappointed "how could it go wrong?" Aside from the tactics-like battles, FFTA is nothing like FFT. Even right down to the job/ability system. And where FFT had to have an in-game reference guide to keep track of the complex storyline and characters, FFTA's can be summed up in just a few paragraphs.

I hope we will be getting a real FFT2 someday. Square seems a little stuck up on re-releasing stuff right now but who knows what the future holds.
 
Jul 27, 2008 at 1:46 AM
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FFTA 2 for DS is out now and it's supposedly pretty good .-.
 
Jul 27, 2008 at 3:05 AM
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RuneLancer said:
I must have missed the romantic involvement between them. Seemed Ritz was more into that Viera following her around than into Marche, IMO... She wasn't very open and warm around him save for one scene needed to give her a reason for wanting to stay in Ivalice.

There were several scenes you get in a specific order culminating in Marche complimenting Ritz, a sort of “Ritz Arc,” so to speak, and that’s about the end of it, really.

RuneLancer said:
Her character felt really just like a flat 2D character-space-waster. Many of the characters do. They only play a minor supporting role to the storyline that's made to appear big (like that Ezel guy who sold those law-breakers - the whole point of that branch was to open up a shop which you'll only use once or twice through the course of the game, or Montblanc who first plays the important role of introducing you to Ivalice and to Clans but then becomes the annoying little sidekick who always agrees with the lead and provides no direct involvement with the storyline.) Where's the development? Aside from everyone's problems with changing things back, we get absolutely nothing out of anyone.

I usually just kill off Montblanc in the Jagd the first chance I get, actually. His stats are absolutely always the same, and they’re so low that Montblanc automatically becomes the weakest major character in the entire game. In contrast, all of the other major characters possess random stats that have a high chance of being higher than the average unit. In any case, Montblanc is to Marche what Shara is to Ritz, a little slave that runs around and does absolutely everything the Human character wants and admires said character to the point of homosexuality.

RuneLancer said:
Except for Mewt. The "villain" (of sorts.) He gets a good deal of development because Ivalice is pretty much his creation. Or at least a reflection of his desires. And while he gets the spotlight often enough, what do we know of the rest of the crew? Montblanc owns a clan, Marche just moved to Ivalice and has trouble making friends, Doned wants attention from his parents, Ritz's hair is pale and she has to dye it (come on Square, try a little harder... -_-), and... I think that's about all there is to know about your guys, really.

Yeah, each of the main characters automatically get a line of dialogue for each mission the moment they’re added. Marche always gets “Let’s kill all these faggots and get it over with,” Montblanc always gets “Yeah, Marche, you’re so awesome, let me suck your cock!” Ritz always gets “I’m such a bitch, let’s do what Marche said!” Shara always gets “Yes, Ritz, you’re so awesome, let me lick your cunt!” Ezel Berbier always gets “MUAHAHA, let’s fuck up the establishment, I’m such a rebel!” Babus Swain gets “Let’s do this for the sake of Ivalice!” and that’s about it. Surprising Ezel and Babus didn’t get into massive arguments in-game every chance they got considering they’re both foils.

RuneLancer said:
FFTA just leaves me with a big sigh followed by a disappointed "how could it go wrong?" Aside from the tactics-like battles, FFTA is nothing like FFT. Even right down to the job/ability system. And where FFT had to have an in-game reference guide to keep track of the complex storyline and characters, FFTA's can be summed up in just a few paragraphs.

Yeah. That was pretty bothering to me as well. Admittedly, the writing for FFTA was pretty damned crappy, especially compared to its predecessor. However, since I was given the chance, I’ve attempted to expand the depth of the story at least somewhat by attempting to display Marche as something he gives off the vide of being.

RuneLancer said:
I hope we will be getting a real FFT2 someday. Square seems a little stuck up on re-releasing stuff right now but who knows what the future holds.

Compilation of Final Fantasy VII and Ivalice Alliance seem to be the most original things they’re currently releasing, and, unfortunately, all of the games from either series suck pretty badly. Square is starting to release III-VI on the DS, and, having played IV, I must say that I was pretty impressed, so here’s to hoping that all those work out.

DoubleThink said:
FFTA 2 for DS is out now and it's supposedly pretty good .-.

FFTA2’s storyline is just a little bit above “go do the missions you asshole,” complete with an entirely unexplained, inexplicable final boss that comes out of nowhere and otherwise poses no threat to the world whatsoever. The protagonists just decide “oh, it must have come from the rift and it’s big and scary, so we need to kill it!” That’s it.
 
Jul 27, 2008 at 3:38 AM
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Kageryushin said:
FFTA2’s storyline is just a little bit above “go do the missions you asshole,” complete with an entirely unexplained, inexplicable final boss that comes out of nowhere and otherwise poses no threat to the world whatsoever. The protagonists just decide “oh, it must have come from the rift and it’s big and scary, so we need to kill it!” That’s it.
I can just see FF20's plot, the way things are going...

The main character, a paranoid schizo (he got this from being exposed to some big magical thingabob, as a surprise plot twist that's revealed halfway through the game), runs around asking everyone if they're the main villain. Ultimately, he finds him, they fight, and the main villain is killed. The main character wipes his forehead with the back of his hand, sighs, says "I'm glad that's over with. Cycle of RPG life, and all that." nonchalantly, and goes back home to watch TV.

What would be great, IMO, is an FFT where you can go exploring outside of the main storyline and do your own little thing. FFT was just one big map with a couple of hidden things every once in a while and some sparse events outside of the main storyline. FFTA was even worse: the only thing about the world map involved placing locations and, when two locations touch, gain items (was there ANY logic to this damned thing AT ALL? Seriously!? It seems like it's just trial and error... nothing hints at how to get any of the items, afaik) There was 0 exploration to be done: the entire map is uncovered (though not all locations; those are given to you when the story calls for it.)
 
Jul 27, 2008 at 4:04 AM
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RuneLancer said:
I can just see FF20's plot, the way things are going...

The main character, a paranoid schizo (he got this from being exposed to some big magical thingabob, as a surprise plot twist that's revealed halfway through the game), runs around asking everyone if they're the main villain. Ultimately, he finds him, they fight, and the main villain is killed. The main character wipes his forehead with the back of his hand, sighs, says "I'm glad that's over with. Cycle of RPG life, and all that." nonchalantly, and goes back home to watch TV.

Lol'd. I bet we'd even let them get away with it, too. There's another problem I've had with how JRPGs are turning out...

I never actually played much of FFXII after finishing it. A diehard fan of the series, I looked forward to FFXII, but... I just couldn't bear it. The "main" character was dull, the focus was all on geopolitics of weird-sounding nations you can't be arsed to learn, the characters themselves didn't evolve or interact beyond the faintest brushes of personality and the combat system was a self-pleasuring atrocity. I killed the first Esper while I WAS TAKING A SHIT. I saw the cutscene, I decided to go take a shit and when I came back, the boss was defeated. Yeah, awesome eh?

While all FFs have always been JRPGs - as in, there's a linear story, you grind, you do some sidequests, but the ending's always the same - and some say they're more akin to movies than actual games, FFXII -is- a movie where your only input is the faux, completely irrelevant illusion that you actually need to get the best weapons and do the grind dance to advance, when enemies and bosses scale in level with you. I mean, Yiazmat, the secret boss, is the pinnacle of generic, boring grinding. You sit there and watch most of the battle going through the same patterns over and over again. But that’s not enough for thirty minutes, you do it FOR HOURS. This is completely unnacceptable to me. Sure, Omega Mk. XII was able to break through this using sheer randomness, but look what happened to him in the USA and PAL versions.

RuneLancer said:
What would be great, IMO, is an FFT where you can go exploring outside of the main storyline and do your own little thing. FFT was just one big map with a couple of hidden things every once in a while and some sparse events outside of the main storyline.

I completely agree. That would be fun as hell. I mean, there's so much you could do with a system like that...

RuneLancer said:
FFTA was even worse: the only thing about the world map involved placing locations and, when two locations touch, gain items (was there ANY logic to this damned thing AT ALL? Seriously!? It seems like it's just trial and error... nothing hints at how to get any of the items, afaik) There was 0 exploration to be done: the entire map is uncovered (though not all locations; those are given to you when the story calls for it.)

Say what you will about FFTA, I still really enjoyed it. Sure, the system isn't perfect, but it definitely worked. I was fully entertained while I played it.
 
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